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Suspension Sub-frame rear falling apart
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mpvinnig
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 17, 2014 6:35 am    Post subject: Suspension Sub-frame rear falling apart Reply with quote

My suspension sub-frame rear for my MPV 2000 is falling apart.

I have had to weld it twice. The second weld is a lot better than the first, but i will raise funds to replace it in the next 6 months. Has this happened to anyone.

My vehicle is 153,020miles on the ODO.


Even more important, why would the suspension sub-frame fail?

Could the use of worn out springs cause it? bad shock absorbers? Should I replace it with brand new or from the junkyard?
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novalight
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 18, 2014 3:03 am    Post subject: Re: Suspension Sub-frame rear falling apart Reply with quote

rust or stress fracture?
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mpvinnig
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 18, 2014 7:32 am    Post subject: Re: Suspension Sub-frame rear falling apart Reply with quote

stress fracture not rust
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novalight
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 18, 2014 1:31 pm    Post subject: Re: Suspension Sub-frame rear falling apart Reply with quote

how old is your suspension setup

this is a cut and paste from else where on the web but does it match your situation?

reason of crack and even rupture of secondary frame is stress concentration occurs in the shaft hole connecting balanced frame with sub-frame because of lateral centroid of goods deviating from the longitudinal symmetry plane caused by goods loading or overloading and maximum stress is beyond the material yield limit.


so possibly old springs

2004 A-spec Touring Edition (look it up)
instagram: Tangofury
Added Suspension: Carbing Tower Bar, TEIN Stechs, Airlift Airbags, Energy Suspension Bushings
Added Exhaust: Cherry BOMB Glasspack, 22" X 3" TIP
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mpvinnig
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 18, 2014 4:40 pm    Post subject: Re: Suspension Sub-frame rear falling apart Reply with quote

as old as the car that's 1999 to date

rear shocks changed a year ago

rear springs about a month ago

the crack are just by the springs, i strongly suspect the springs, since they appeared to have lost their usefulness a long time ago , i.e., sagging under loads as low as 4 people and totally bottoming out at 7 with the tires scraping the underbody
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novalight
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 18, 2014 4:53 pm    Post subject: Re: Suspension Sub-frame rear falling apart Reply with quote

well maybe you are correct with the ssprings u replaced with juckyard ones if i recall that were just as old, might wanna find new ones, did u also replae the rubber mounts
2004 A-spec Touring Edition (look it up)
instagram: Tangofury
Added Suspension: Carbing Tower Bar, TEIN Stechs, Airlift Airbags, Energy Suspension Bushings
Added Exhaust: Cherry BOMB Glasspack, 22" X 3" TIP
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mpvinnig
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 19, 2014 12:03 am    Post subject: Re: Suspension Sub-frame rear falling apart Reply with quote

I strongly suspect that sagging springs unable to carry and distribute the weight of the vehicle properly led to this.

No I did not replace the rubber mounts, but I will

Let me make some clarifications

- the cracks appeared a long time ago, let's say 5 months ago when I had not replaced the springs with those from the junkyard

- the cracks were not very wide then, but it was a matter of sufficient concern to me that I had to have them welded, and they appeared at the welds very close to were the springs sit on both the left and right coil spring seat

- I have since come to realize that the previous weld was less than perfect, that is to say, it was insufficient

- The new weld is very thorough and covers the field, the whole area has been welded in such a way that it cannot ever give up but all the same when I have a bit more cash on hand i will replace the unit

- I had a severe case of overloading three weeks ago and that might be responsible for the cracks worsening now

- the replaced springs though junkyard have done a better job of carrying the weight of the car than the worn out one ( so the conditions I described in the previous post relate the the old springs, not the replaced ones)

- Like i said earlier, replacing the suspension sub-frame rear and all its related components except the shocks which are just a year old with new is a major investment, so I have to budget for it ( say in the next 6 months)
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novalight
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 19, 2014 1:02 am    Post subject: Re: Suspension Sub-frame rear falling apart Reply with quote

maybe u should put in some airlift bags in the springs
2004 A-spec Touring Edition (look it up)
instagram: Tangofury
Added Suspension: Carbing Tower Bar, TEIN Stechs, Airlift Airbags, Energy Suspension Bushings
Added Exhaust: Cherry BOMB Glasspack, 22" X 3" TIP
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aha
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 20, 2014 9:43 am    Post subject: Re: Suspension Sub-frame rear falling apart Reply with quote

Any sign of accidents from the past?
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mpvinnig
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 20, 2014 10:53 am    Post subject: Re: Suspension Sub-frame rear falling apart Reply with quote

no, not at all. Matter of fact, this development is less than 6 months old
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novalight
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 21, 2014 1:42 am    Post subject: Re: Suspension Sub-frame rear falling apart Reply with quote

so basically my theory is that since your old springs where worn and the rubber seats they are in are also fatigued continuous heavy loading and bumps sends the spring energy into the subframe since the seats are no longer absorbing the energy, and with old springs you have less flexibility causing more energy to go directly to the sub frame


but im not an engineer by any means in fact i bake cookies all day

2004 A-spec Touring Edition (look it up)
instagram: Tangofury
Added Suspension: Carbing Tower Bar, TEIN Stechs, Airlift Airbags, Energy Suspension Bushings
Added Exhaust: Cherry BOMB Glasspack, 22" X 3" TIP
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mpvinnig
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 21, 2014 3:00 am    Post subject: Re: Suspension Sub-frame rear falling apart Reply with quote

novalight wrote:
so basically my theory is that since your old springs where worn and the rubber seats they are in are also fatigued continuous heavy loading and bumps sends the spring energy into the subframe since the seats are no longer absorbing the energy, and with old springs you have less flexibility causing more energy to go directly to the sub frame


but im not an engineer by any means in fact i bake cookies all day


I want to believe the theory above since this has been going on for no less than 6 years (that is since 2008), and while i didn't mention it, my roads are rather bumpy. Add to that a family of 7 growups and worn out shocks.

Indeed I have read somewhere that failure to replace worn out suspension parts as and when due results in other suspension parts getting worn out.

I guess I am a practical example of the above.

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mpvinnig
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PostPosted: Mon May 04, 2015 2:22 am    Post subject: Re: Suspension Sub-frame rear falling apart Reply with quote

I saw a 2004 with the same problem, so now I know mine isn't an isolated case!
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Timekop
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2015 8:05 pm    Post subject: Re: Suspension Sub-frame rear falling apart Reply with quote

My 2003 has this same issue. Along with the cracks, rust and decay are also present. Shocks have been replaced and I have never replaced the springs. I wonder what kind of safety issue this may be and if there is a fix?
2003 MPV LX
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mpvinnig
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 30, 2015 11:38 am    Post subject: Re: Suspension Sub-frame rear falling apart Reply with quote

Timekop wrote:
My 2003 has this same issue. Along with the cracks, rust and decay are also present. Shocks have been replaced and I have never replaced the springs. I wonder what kind of safety issue this may be and if there is a fix?


I will post pictures of how i fixed mine.

It is indeed a safety issue, if it were to cut into two?

Does yours bottom out with full load?
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