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PO431, buying catalytic converters/manifold
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rsj337333
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 04, 2011 9:15 pm    Post subject: PO431, buying catalytic converters/manifold Reply with quote

i have a 2003 mazda mpv LX, 125,000 miles, non california emission. i currently have the po431. that was brought on due to faulty ignitions coils that i waited to replaced because i had a hard time dianosing which coil it was. i thought a misfire light would come on that never did. but after reading some threads on here i realize that not the case.. now i would like to replaced the catalytic converter on bank 2 (close to the radiator). went to the dealer and got a sticker shock when i realized how much the cats go for. the question i have is: has anybody had any experience using the after market cats? are the after market cats any good and reliable. also where would i find an affordable online site that i can order these catalytic converter from. any advice would be appreiated.
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MotoRoto
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Joined: 30 Mar 2009
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Location: Edmonton, AB, CA

PostPosted: Wed Jul 06, 2011 3:40 pm    Post subject: Re: PO431, buying catalytic converters/manifold Reply with quote

I'm not sure about the US but in Canada I think we have a 10 year warranty on emission control items that may include the cats.

As for aftermarket, I know there are many performance cats that offer the same level of emission control but far less restriction. I cannot comment on MPV application or longevity though.

Now:
12 Odyssey
99 Protege (Original Owner)

Then:
68 VW Type III Fastback
85 RX7 GS
87 RX7 TII
06 MPV (Original Owner, written off 08/13/2012 w/ 81k Kms).
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savedsol
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Joined: 03 Aug 2005
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Location: Chicago, IL, USA

PostPosted: Thu Jul 07, 2011 12:54 pm    Post subject: Re: PO431, buying catalytic converters/manifold Reply with quote

Gut your cat - punch out all of the junk and get a spacer for the 02 sensor to keep another CEL from coming on. Aftermarket cats are available from lots of places like Random Tech and Magnaflow. Finding one to fit and then getting it welded will be a couple hundred. There's another cat downstream.
2005 MPV - Black Mica: Grey Leather / HID
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savedsol
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Joined: 03 Aug 2005
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Location: Chicago, IL, USA

PostPosted: Thu Jul 07, 2011 12:55 pm    Post subject: Re: PO431, buying catalytic converters/manifold Reply with quote

Gut your cat - punch out all of the junk and get a spacer for the 02 sensor to keep another CEL from coming on. Aftermarket cats are available from lots of places like Random Tech and Magnaflow. Finding one to fit and then getting it welded will be a couple hundred. There's another cat downstream.
2005 MPV - Black Mica: Grey Leather / HID
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scross
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 07, 2011 8:00 pm    Post subject: Re: PO431, buying catalytic converters/manifold Reply with quote

Along those same lines, if you need to remove the cat anyway, just take it off, knock on it with a rubber mallet a few times, then see what comes out. Could be some melted catalyst, could be lots of soot, or whatever, but there's a high probability that you'll bring it back to life just as long as it's not completely empty. Note that I'm not suggesting that you gut out the cat itself - as that is probably illegal (cough, cough) - but only that you remove any crud and useless catalyst.

Also, it's possible to actually clean a cat multiple ways. One is just by using some kind of cleaning solution - maybe nothing more than laundry detergent and water - and letting it soak. There are videos about this on YouTube and such. Another way (supposedly) is to take it off and cook it on your grill for a while - to let the heat and relatively fresh air take care of any issues. I suppose that there are other options, too, but you'd have to dig around for them. The point here, though, is that you really have nothing to lose by trying to revive the cat, even if the cleaning methods sound unorthodox, and you might even save some serious money. If you try anything like this then let us know how it goes.
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Frank P
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 05, 2011 1:16 am    Post subject: Re: PO431, buying catalytic converters/manifold Reply with quote

Hi all, new member here. I just finished today with replacing both cats/exhaust manifolds on my wife's 2001 MPV. Took me about 9-10 hours with me on my back over a two day period, I should have used my buddies lift and garage which I'm sure would have shorten the time involved. I spent about $1,200 on manifolds, sensors and miscellaneous items. I don't know what the total cost would have been if done in a shop but I'm sure it would have been twice what I spent. It was quite a learning experience and I'm sure I could now do another MPV much quicker now knowing what tools and what has to be connected/disconnected or removed. I also thought about just trying to trick the CEL and computer and even built an O2 simulator but I figured if it was enough to cause the cel to trip, I might as well fix what was wrong rather than maybe cause a bigger problem later on. Mazda engineers must have had their head up their a** when they designed the cat/manifold into one, instead of locating the cat further down the exhaust pipe like their American counter parts. Anyway that's my rant. Sorry to be long winded but I'm glad I found this site and look forward to reading and learning more.
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rsj337333
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 13, 2011 3:31 pm    Post subject: Re: PO431, buying catalytic converters/manifold Reply with quote

hey frank p. where did u end up purchasing your cats from? and what other parts did u need?
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ponderosaTX
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 15, 2011 12:12 am    Post subject: Re: PO431, buying catalytic converters/manifold Reply with quote

I recommend the non-fouler trick for curing P0421 and P0431 codes. You can do it in about 20 minutes if you buy an O2 sensor extender from Ebay, which bypasses the need to drill out a spark plug anti-fouler.

See: http://forum.mpvclub.com/viewtopic.php?t=22162
and search for other threads focusing on P0421/P0431 codes.

For the record, I don't think there is any difference between CA and non-CA MPVs in the 2003 model year. All 2003 MPV have four cats: a warmup cat and main cat for each cylinder bank. The OBD-II monitoring system collects data from four O2 sensors: one immediately before and after each warmup-cat. P0431 indicates that the Bank 2 warmup cat is functioning below threshold. Mazda reportedly sets the threshold for reporting a fault at 90-95% of specified cat efficiency. I would not trust an aftermarket cat to meet this spec for very long. (I am not certain that the 90-95% claim is true, but it is not clear that vehicles with a P0431 code actually pollute any more than those that have no codes. The main cat for each bank is completely unmonitored by the OBD-II system.) The O2 sensor downstream from the Bank 2 warmup cat does not measure pollution. It measures O2 content in the exhaust stream. The ECU (engine management and diagnostic computer) expects the after-cat O2 sensor to see less variation on O2 levels than the pre-cat O2 sensor. I am skeptical about spending a lot of money to comply with a spec that may not have much if any impact on actual pollution levels.
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