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93 mpv 4wd
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stugguls
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 11, 2015 1:47 pm    Post subject: 93 mpv 4wd Reply with quote

Hi,

This is my 1 st post here, inherited my mom's 93 mpv 4wd 59k miles, did the timing belt recently and other related services. Problem, first shift into overdrive takes miles when cold, after that shifts normally. Haven't found anything on line addressing that issue. Oil looks clean and full. I'm wondering if there is a sensor that regulates that shift ? I think I'll pull the trans pan, replace the filter and do a partial fill of new fluid as suggested on this site. Anyone have a clue what could cause the delayed shifting? Also, is the trans a mazda build or some other brand?

Other than the trans thing, what a nice well built old ride.

Thanks for the advise

stugguls
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ctom3
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Joined: 17 Mar 2004
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Location: Clear Lake, The Best Part of Houston, TX, USA

PostPosted: Mon Jan 12, 2015 5:18 pm    Post subject: Re: 93 mpv 4wd Reply with quote

Welcome to the club. Sorry that you haven't received a response before now. This forum isn't very active these days. Most MPV's have been worn out and the owners have moved on.

Man, that is low mileage for a van its age. I wouldn't be surprised if you have some goo in the valve body. The best recommendation is to try exactly what you are doing. The common technique was to pull the passenger side tranny hose off of the radiator and put it in a jug. Pull the lead of the spark coil so that the engine won't start and have someone crank the engine while you watch. Assuming that the tranny fluid is at the full mark on the dipstick, pump out 4 quarts. Re-attach the hose and fill the tranny back with 4-quarts new fluid. Drive for a while and repeat the procedure twice. I would suggest that before you fill it for the last time, but while it is down 4 quarts, pull the pan and replace the filter screen. While it is open, look for crud. There should be minimal build up and crud in it. Install the filter and pan, and refill. This is your best hope. If that doesn't fix it, then you may replace the shift relays since that isn't too expensive. If that doesn't work, then you need to make a value decision about keeping the van.

Here is a fairly recent response I made to someone regarding the 4-quart change-out:

http://forum.mazda5club.com/viewtopic.php?t=15092&sid=fdd079a9761eeb2894ed38c5127f0169

The following goes into more detail on fluid change. This and timing belt changes were probably the most discussed topics on the site 10 years ago.

http://forum.mpvclub.com/viewtopic.php?t=6459&highlight=atf+driveway

Good Luck!
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Manitoba MPV
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Joined: 11 Nov 2004
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Location: Winnipeg, MB, CA

PostPosted: Mon Jan 12, 2015 7:39 pm    Post subject: Re: 93 mpv 4wd Reply with quote

Hi Stugguis, and welcome!

That sounds like a great machine.

The 'filter' in my '97 was actually a screen rather than a true filter, and replacing it was a bit of a waste. I should have just cleaned it.

Can anyone confirm that's the case with the '93 as well?

I second Ctom's thoughts on the 4-qt drain & fill as an alternative to dropping the pan.

Ctom3, it's great to see you still on the board, even as an ex-MPVer.

Manitoba MPV

'82 GLC 1.5 5-speed ('82 - '95); '79 GLC Sport 1.4 5-speed ('87 - '89); '85 626 2.0 5-speed ('97 - '05); '90 MPV 2WD 2.6 5-speed ('96 - '01); '95 Bawngo GL Super 9 pass 2.0 5-speed ('03 - '04); '97 AllSport 2WD 3.0 auto ('01 - ?); '01 Protege 1.6 5-speed ('05 - '13); '09 Mazda 5 GT 5-speed ('13 - ?)
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stugguls
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 12, 2015 7:49 pm    Post subject: Re: 93 mpv 4wd Reply with quote

Thanks for the info. Would be sad to see such a good ride go to the scrap especially with such low mileage. I stopped by a friends today who has been wrenching for 30 yrs and he thinks its more than likely is a solenoid. His thought was that trans had to come out to change these? I'm looking into that now. I think that is a R4ael trans? If the solenoids can be changed without pulling the trans its a no brainier. Even if it cost more than the car is worth for trans fix, might still worth it considering the cost of newer cars of a lesser quality these days? It was also my late mom's car a little bit of stupid sentimental stuff too.

My old 93 d250 cummins needs all connections from the signal generator on the trans to the tps cleaned once a year for it to shift into od properly. I'm going to check the connections on the mazda to see if that makes a difference.

Thanks again

stugguls
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ctom3
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Location: Clear Lake, The Best Part of Houston, TX, USA

PostPosted: Mon Jan 12, 2015 8:45 pm    Post subject: Re: 93 mpv 4wd Reply with quote

Thanks, Manitoba. I found it hard to leave. While I have had other cars that out perform the MPV in pretty much every aspect, I'd still have a gen 1 MPV if I didn't drive 30K+ miles/year. It had an excellent balance of size and capability. Plus, I've always enjoyed the intelligence and good nature of the members.

Stugguls, I said relay, but meant solenoid. Your mechanic friend may very well be right. It has been a long time since I cracked open the bottom of a tranny. Both MPV's I had were 2wd, so between time and a different drive train, I cannot say for certain how to access them in your van. Hopefully, some other members can jump in and answer your question on the 4wd
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croc
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 12, 2015 8:56 pm    Post subject: Re: 93 mpv 4wd Reply with quote

I imagine if it were the case, somebody would have said so, but... Mine does this too. It shifts once the engine temp reaches fully warm-every time. Every old Toyota I've had does this and it's totally normal. Pay attention to it and see if it doesn't shift into o/d at the same time engine temp reaches fully warm. The higher revs in the mean time don't hurt a thing and in fact is healthy for it. Engines were made to rev don't be afraid of it!
1998 Mazda MPV ES 4x4, 187k, green/tan, leather, sunroof, tow package
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ctom3
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 12, 2015 9:27 pm    Post subject: Re: 93 mpv 4wd Reply with quote

My '95 Miata does this. Yes, I admit that I have a Miata with an auto tranny. It was the compromise I made with DW to even have a small sports car. Anyway, it is specifically designed to hold in a low gear until it warms up. However, neither of my MPV's did it, but I cannot speak to 4wd's.
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Manitoba MPV
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 12, 2015 10:19 pm    Post subject: Re: 93 mpv 4wd Reply with quote

The tranny on the '97 is designed to not shift into OD (4th) until the tranny fluid temperature has reached a certain temperature, I think +10 C.

With the deep freeze weather we're experiencing here combined with fairly short trips , I'm not seeing a lot of OD lately.

Manitoba MPV

'82 GLC 1.5 5-speed ('82 - '95); '79 GLC Sport 1.4 5-speed ('87 - '89); '85 626 2.0 5-speed ('97 - '05); '90 MPV 2WD 2.6 5-speed ('96 - '01); '95 Bawngo GL Super 9 pass 2.0 5-speed ('03 - '04); '97 AllSport 2WD 3.0 auto ('01 - ?); '01 Protege 1.6 5-speed ('05 - '13); '09 Mazda 5 GT 5-speed ('13 - ?)
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ou812
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 12, 2015 10:19 pm    Post subject: Re: 93 mpv 4wd Reply with quote

All gen 1's are known for doing this. I wouldn't worry about it. If it was a solenoid, the hold/od light would be flashing. You don't need to drop the tranny to change the solenoids, just the valve body. You can't change out just one solenoid, they have to be changed out as a set.

(yeah, 59k is a nice number. a nice low number. hard to find any with mileage that low.)

'91 silver MPV (gone)
'94 white MPV (gone)
"I want my, I want my, I want my MPV"
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ctom3
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 12, 2015 10:56 pm    Post subject: Re: 93 mpv 4wd Reply with quote

I didn't know this about MPV's. Good solution... move to Houston, TX!
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croc
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 13, 2015 8:52 am    Post subject: Re: 93 mpv 4wd Reply with quote

ctom3 wrote:
My '95 Miata does this. Yes, I admit that I have a Miata with an auto tranny. It was the compromise I made with DW to even have a small sports car. Anyway, it is specifically designed to hold in a low gear until it warms up. However, neither of my MPV's did it, but I cannot speak to 4wd's.


Hey don't sweat the auto trans. Turbochargers work better on auto cars Cool

1998 Mazda MPV ES 4x4, 187k, green/tan, leather, sunroof, tow package
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croc
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 13, 2015 8:55 am    Post subject: Re: 93 mpv 4wd Reply with quote

ou812 wrote:
All gen 1's are known for doing this. I wouldn't worry about it. If it was a solenoid, the hold/od light would be flashing. You don't need to drop the tranny to change the solenoids, just the valve body. You can't change out just one solenoid, they have to be changed out as a set.

(yeah, 59k is a nice number. a nice low number. hard to find any with mileage that low.)


Mr.Ou, are you aware of any valve body modifying kits or mods? Such as stiffer accumulator springs, or other valve body modifications (drilling out passages, etc) MPV info is so hard to find.

1998 Mazda MPV ES 4x4, 187k, green/tan, leather, sunroof, tow package
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ou812
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 13, 2015 10:48 am    Post subject: Re: 93 mpv 4wd Reply with quote

No valve body mods that I know of. There could be some though, I just don't know of any. There used to be a list on this site, of other vehicles this tranny is in, but a lot of info was lost during a hack.
'91 silver MPV (gone)
'94 white MPV (gone)
"I want my, I want my, I want my MPV"
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Manitoba MPV
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 13, 2015 7:03 pm    Post subject: Re: 93 mpv 4wd Reply with quote

IIRC, both automatic trannies ( i.e. '89 - '95, and '96 - '98 ) are Jatco 4-speeds.

An AT tech told me that mine ( in the '97 ) was very common, used in the Nissan Pathfinder of the day, etc.

I bet there's something out there on them.

Manitoba MPV

'82 GLC 1.5 5-speed ('82 - '95); '79 GLC Sport 1.4 5-speed ('87 - '89); '85 626 2.0 5-speed ('97 - '05); '90 MPV 2WD 2.6 5-speed ('96 - '01); '95 Bawngo GL Super 9 pass 2.0 5-speed ('03 - '04); '97 AllSport 2WD 3.0 auto ('01 - ?); '01 Protege 1.6 5-speed ('05 - '13); '09 Mazda 5 GT 5-speed ('13 - ?)
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Manitoba MPV
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 13, 2015 7:07 pm    Post subject: Re: 93 mpv 4wd Reply with quote

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jatco_4R01_transmission

Yay for Wiki once again. Looks like all of the 1st-gen MPVs use the same tranny (unless equipped with that beautiful 5-speed manual).

Manitoba MPV

'82 GLC 1.5 5-speed ('82 - '95); '79 GLC Sport 1.4 5-speed ('87 - '89); '85 626 2.0 5-speed ('97 - '05); '90 MPV 2WD 2.6 5-speed ('96 - '01); '95 Bawngo GL Super 9 pass 2.0 5-speed ('03 - '04); '97 AllSport 2WD 3.0 auto ('01 - ?); '01 Protege 1.6 5-speed ('05 - '13); '09 Mazda 5 GT 5-speed ('13 - ?)
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